N8B - Nathan Bowen

Well, I appreciate the sentiment, but I don't feel embarassed, because in my opinion, you didn't actually correct me.

In fact, you help make my point when you mention Lil' Wayne as a way to debunk me. It is to this band's and to my argument's credit that you draw that analogy and I will illustrate from scripute how that is the case. We as Christians do not have a monopoly on truth. "What?" you ask, "how can that be?" Easy, think about that statement. It is a basic theological truth many in the body are guilty of constantly violating. But are we not all made in God's image (Gen 1:27)? Do not the heavens and the earth declare his glory and display knowledge (Ps. 19:1-2)? Is there not anything that is shared experience with all mankind (Ecc. 1:10)? These verses dont just apply to Christians.

I will say it again, Christians do not have a monopoly on truth, they just know it's ultimate source. To prove further, this was why Paul, when speaking to the Greeks, quoted both a pagan philosopher and poet in Acts 17. And he used it to point to Christ. He used the truth BOTH of these pagans saw and expressed, and pointed it to Christ. In that same chapter, he used scriptures when talking to Jews to point to Christ. Two completely different approaches for two distinct people groups. this is the application of his dictum, "i become all things to all people..."

Do we do this and cross over into sin just to win them? Absolutely not! Did NRF cross that boundary? perhaps. But I will not be the holy spirit FOR them. And you know why? because I see their fruit, and I know they seek after Christ, and so, I will not focus on correcting them, but encouraging them. Kind of like Christ did with the disciples. He corrected them, yes, but you will find more encouragement by far. (Mercy overcomes judgment)

We have to stop condemning people for not following "the rules." That was what the people who crucified Chris focused on. He literally was not holy enough for them. think about that. They crucified Jesus because he wasn't holy enough. wow. Let's try to see people as God does-works in progress. How else could the angel of the Lord go to Gideon, who was cowering in a cave and hiding from the battle, say, "Mighty man of God!"

I am ashamed by many Christians in the body because it is so obvious they focus on what is wrong with fellow brothers and sisters and not what is right with them. Now, there is a time for correction, and God has set up a system for it. We are to go to a brother in private as a first recourse. And God has set up accountability and leadership. God has not called anyone that i know of to a ministry of rebuke. I dont see that in scripture either. the only thing that comes close is the old testament prophets (jeremiah notably) but that was a different time, and a different covenant!

Let our first recourse follow the pattern of scripture! I love ya, Nathan, and every other one who reads this. I appreciate the dialogue. good debate is healthy, and struggling over the word and its application. Let's make sure our motivation is from Love according to 1 Corinthians 13.

go to the top comments and read. it explains. it really does have a great message

all i can say is listen to all of their music! youtube cut me by j-remy listen to lonely people also on this site. the bible says judge not so that we should not be judged. their not trying to reach christians their reaching a hurting world. I can vouch for every member of this band and say that they all Love the Lord. We as christians are so concerned with what the church thinks about us. has it ever occured to you that the world looks at the church as a divided bunch of hypocrites because all we do is tear down one another whenever anyone trys something different than the norm. remember people that Kirk franklin, Bebe & Cece Winans & even walter hawkins and Andre crouch were all challenged by the church as being to secular. judge them by their works. if people are being led to Christ by what they are doing I feel that there's nothing to debate about here. Jason R. brother of the keyboard player

This is a secular somg by gospel artists.i ain't heard da album,so mayb on it there's an intro or somethin explaining.i say check out da album then judge it.God Bless!OH Yeah not feeling da song!

How can you hear God, if you don't listen. Can you here Him now? Just Listen.

Great song... but PLEASE never rhyme anything with the doo doo ever again

Keep God First...you know God does not bring you anywhere to leave you......You guys know God is Blessing you right now to spead the Gospel to lost souls (in the world and in CHURCH) NRF........Keep doing the will of God and Pray for those who Judge you.....love you guys....

the drummer's sister

Check out the sound clip here: http://www.stereotruth.net/201...gritty-ep/

It gives a short explanation of the songs on the Nitty Gritty EP from New Rebel Flag. Maybe that will help connect the ties the song is making.

There are way too many haters. I only read some of the comments but what it comes down to is the man's heart. The song didn't have a lot of meat to it, correct. But it didn't talk about sex, drugs, cars and rims. Time will tell if an artist is legit or not. Pray for your bothers. Don't bring em down.

Don't analyze things. I love this song.

i still say they check out Pro MURDER SWAG its the other song on the music player and its got TRUTH to it unlike this

Does anyone know what the word swag means? It means a person's style or attitude. Is it now a sin to like one's style, are people saying that it's wrong to wear name band clothes, or to look nice. Yes having a prideful attitude ABOUT YOURSELF is a sin. Now I think in this song they're talking about their swag as their style and attitude in Christ. It does not say in the Bible that a prideful attitude torwards God is a sin, in fact that's how we should be towards God. Just because they did not come out and say God's name, makes this song not about God. What about those song's we sang in church that instead of saying God's name it says "You". We instantly know it's about God, why because we are in church so it has to be. How about the Christian Rock Group "Thousand Foot Krutch" (Awesome Band), most of their songs they never meantion the name of Jesus, but its ok because we know what their talking about. How is that right?

yeah thats a good verse but guess what he never says "I will Sin to reach others"
i mean look these guys talkin about they swag and how big it is and all that, well thats messed up. that right there is pride.
now try and tell me that the swag is for Christ, well that aint Christ like.
holla.

Ok I know there are a lot of Christians that believe that the gospel isn't supposed to offend, but be a false view of nothing goes wrong when you’re a Christian. That's why so many none believers don't become Christian because we as Christians make it seem like life is peachy. Then when they see our lives hitting the wall (Because God is testing us to make our walk with him stronger) they decide not to convert because they see no different in their walk and ours through struggles.
And about the word “hoe” in the song it’s not talking about a sexually active woman this is the phase that it’s in “This gold diggers keep digging on me, I’m only showing them what I want them to see. So here goes some shovel hoes, and keep digging on me.” The word hoe in this phase is talking about the garden tool used to dig. What they are saying is here are some tools because the word is trying to dig up dirt on me. And here is a verse from the bible that maybe more Christians should try to use and maybe we will lead more people to Christ.


1 Corinthians 9:19-23
For though I am free from all, I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win more of them. To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though not being myself under the law) that I might win those under the law. To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law. To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all people, that by all means I might save some. I do it all for the sake of the gospel, that I may share with them in its blessings.

A rich kid can not go to the hood and lead people to Christ because they just don’t relate. Just like someone from the hood can not go to a rich area and reach someone. Don’t get me wrong I’m sure a rich kid reach out and lead a dude from the hood to Christ, but if it’s someone that people can relate to mostly they will listen more. And that’s what I think New Rebel Flag is trying to do.

look this song has crap in it so thats that, all ne talks about is swag and girls

Before making a comment, everyone needs to read Nathan Bowen's comment under:
"ADRESSING THIS REOCURRING PROBLEM (Its long but worth reading)."

I couldn't have said it better myself.

Took me an hour to read through all of these postings...very wide ranging set of views. So, I will just put my perspective this way:

New Rebel Flag = Arm
KJ52 = Leg
Grits = Foot
116 Clique = Fingers
Lecrae = Ears
etc, etc,

Some of us like the way the Foot works...others of us relate to the Ears. It's all the same Body.

Selah

amen sister! i think these guys should check out pro's song "Murder Swag" might do em some good. and no i aint hatin or anything

honestly i really do not think this song glorifies the name of Jesus in anyway. Yea it has a nice beat and hook, but as gospel artists shouldnt your music(lyrics) be something that captures the essence of God's own heart? why is this group talking about broads and hoes? all in all im HIGHLY dissapointed. As a 17 year old female this is the last thing i want to hear bumpn in my ipod while i chill and i definitely wouldnt recommend this song to anybody, especially not my non-christian friends. If we are the light of the world why do we continue to "water down" our lyrics and music so much so that it begins to resemble the world. There are plenty of artists who arent christian who have a track that doesnt curse or talk about lust and fleshly desires but that doesnt make them gospel rap artists. We are suppose to be spreading the good news of Christ Jesus our Lord and Savior. So stop being have hearted christians! Either your going to serve him or not. Theres no if, ands or buts about it because on that faithful day there will be no excuses... Im jus being real!

hey whats up? love the song but wasn't sure if it said hoes keep diggin on me as in whore...could you help me out?

I've just recently had a conversation with Jremy of "New Rebel Flag" through email and I asked him two question: 1) Are you and the guys in your band Christians. 2) Does your band claim to be a Christian band.
Here is his answer word for word......................


Hey buddy how you doing ?
To answer your question we are all born again believers and serve in are home churches .. As far as new rebel flag band it is a outreach to the world we feel called to identify with the world to reach the hurting.. are music is harsh in a sense 100% raw honest no sugar coating . To be honest we are finding the body of Christ is shocked by it at first .. And the world is touched by it and. Open to hear more about what we do and why we write the way we do witch gives us a opportunity to speak about Christ. That's the short version if you would like to know more give a call anytime. 985788****

Ps we don't make music to entertain Christian we create music to reach the world . Honestly wish more Christian would start to feel that way.

Blessing man.
Remy
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry




I think they have a great point, Go to their new website www.newrebelflag.com and see what they are about. And I'm sure most of the people talking about this group has only heard this song from them.

you know what after thinking about it and all. i think i have to agree with ya man. i mean come on he says some things a Christian should not be sayin... about the swagger and about the girls and all that...

oh come on rapzilla dont dumb down now! i mean s3riously why is this song even on here?? u know it aint Christian. it glorifies the flesh and all its lustful desires. mocks the standard of faith i had in you, not even near righteouss, what's happened yall? im not suprised it got 4 stars [folks jus go for beat these days, me included]: but the message portrayed by this jus broke my heart cmon get rid of this. this is bad image

anyone know where i can get the lyrics to this song?

yeah this song has its ups and downs but i think all and all it bangin i like it

p.s. BIG x1000 ups to jeff youngblood for doing a much better job than me. even if you can counter my post, he used scripture and you can't argue with that.

stop hatin on everyone who doesn't fit your shallow definition of a christian artist! frankly, its very legalistic when you say "this is christian and this isn't" like you some kinda prophet. God didn't tell you what kinda music he wanted New Rebel Flag to make. He told New Rebel Flag what kinda music He wanted New Rebel Flag to make. if y'all had it your way, the eleventh commandment would be "thou shalt use my name in every other line if your a rapper. do this and ye shall escape the fires of Sheol." Pettidee dont/didnt. Grits don't/didn't. P.I.D. didn't. and you can believe ther would be no christian hip hop without any of them. especially P.I.D., because they invented christian hip hop. if you could see how many souls are saved by people like this, you wouldn't be so quick to judge. y? because God can work through anyone and anything. when you post comments like 90% of yall are (bigups to those who didnt) not only are you putting chh in a box, but you are putting God in a box. think about it.

It is very possible that New Rebel Flag intended good when they released this song, but it is too…… controversial. I believe that songs should have a clear, concise main theme and branch off of that theme. These fellows do have a central idea (filthy, nasty, dirty, grimy), but it is not clear whether are talking about how they stuggle against the world……… or how they glorify themselves because they are "sitting big" so to speak.

How About you all leave these guys lone
alone I met these guys on tour
in joplin mo and they are sold out FOR gOD for GOD]
AND SHOWED LOVE LIKE CHRIST WOULD
SHOW SO SHOW SOME LOVE BACK

Sorry, Not to embarrass but to correct in love. Jeff Youngblood said

"But I really get the heart of what they are expressing. It might be one of the most artful hip-hop portrayals of man's fallen nature I have ever heard."

The problem with that is anyone can get what was just said from a Lil Wayne CD. I know the "reach a worldly audience excuse", but Christian music will not be seen as Christian music unless its Christian. We make music that cannot easily be recognized by sinners as Christian so that we can "infiltrate" the industry, I guess. What does any of that mean if the world cant decipher the message. Many artists are making a strange transition from Christian music to "positive worldly music". You want songs to draw people near to God when the song doesn't even mention God.And these people don't know God. What ever happened to being unashamed of His name. Do any of us realize that CHRIST is the root the word of Christian. The word means Christ-like one, or Christ-like person.Why should we be ashamed of it. Are we afraid of suffering criticism under the Christian "label" (as they call it).
-1 Peter 4:16
Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

The irony is may believers do not want to be labeled as Christian anymore. I my self nearly fell into this. But "follower of Jesus" is a label too, ITS JUST LONGER. In the same way many artist seek to escape the label Christian, but they undoubtedly run the risk of being labeled worldly if they choose to do so.

We should not stray from looking and sounding Christian in the representation of our faith in any way.You cant save a man from a pit by jumping in there with him. Why not pull them toward Christ. Why not reach out and lend a hand to pull men out of the pit.We can show them we're human, but we should not show ourselves to be worldly in order to save the worldly. We'll just get LOST in the process.

We should represent a difference from the world, because if we are in the world and not of the world it will show in our life. If we are the opposite it will show also.

Which do you see in this song, and similar music?


(This addresses all of the Christian music taking a similar approach).

I think its talking about how we feel dirty and nasty but god can still help us. i like this song because it IS looking from a different persepective. but if you think about how is other people who have not been touched by god supposed understand other songz that says god. i think this is a good way to help people understand God ?? God Bless u
:
P

Ok I know a lot of people on here have mixed feels about this song and the band, and where they stand with God. But what if someone unsaved heard this song on the radio, and they were feeling it. So they go to the store the next day find the CD and buy it, not knowing that it’s a Christian band. They put the CD into their CD player and boom God starts working in this person life just using a CD that Christian are putting down. Now people shouldn’t we give this amazing Christian web site the benefit of the doubt that just maybe they are filtering and approving songs and bands before they put them on the site. I know for a fact that unsaved people will not go out and buy a Christian Rap CD no matter how hard the beat hits on their system. We as Christians are the reason that unsaved people are not coming to know our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, because we make ourselves seem perfect and we are quick to judge but slow to forgive. Shouldn’t it be the other way around? God Bless Everyone

I think its talking about how we feel dirty and nasty but god can still help us. i like this song because it IS looking from a different persepective. but if you think about how is other people who have not been touched by god supposed understand other songz that says god. i think this is a good way to help people understand God ?? God Bless u

I think the song is looking in someone elses shoes, and talking about how they feel filthy and nasty. And kinda looking in there shoes and how they act. And i know that they don't mention God or anything. But if you go on their myspace you can listen to a sample of their new EP and the first one called spoken. Its kinda like an intro and he talks about God and their bands misson, or something like that. But just because it doesnt say God or speaks about his word, sometimes you have to look at it from a different perspective. Which is the worlds view. Atleast thats what i see out of this song, and of course i could be wrong, cause im not perfect. lol. And i hope this makes since, if not sorry!

Say you were in Wal-Mart and theyre song was playing over the loudspeaker. You would probably have no idea this song would even relate to God at all. And if it's just whats in your mind that counts, then Kanye West is also a Christian because he sang Jesus Walks.

It says in 1 Peter 4:11, "f any man speak as the oracles of God; if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth; that God in all things may be glorified through jesus Christ, to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."

I'm so happy to have the body of christ chopping it up talking about the pros and cons of what we do! Promise you this there's no wanna be gangsters here.. That funny. But check it out you want to know are heart give me call let's chop it up! 9857887710 blessing remy

Frieman 123,

No offense intended, but I marvel at the simplicity of your question.

Mathew 7 is but one place you will find the answer.

16By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

or mathew 5:

16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.


I am not going to single you out with what I am about to say, but if it might apply, think about it:

In so many places God talks about people who use deceptive speech. Things that "SOUND" godly. And it amazes me how intellectually and spiritually lazy Christians in the west have become. They want to be spoon fed. They want to judge everything by appearance alone. They have no idea how to hear God's voice, because their mind's are un-renewed. The don't know how to rightly divide the word, they don't earnestly search the scriptures, but instead receive whatever their "leaders" tell them. Many are being mislead. Culture has infiltrated the church, and not for the good.

Our culture is one of intellectual laziness, one that puts the ultimate premium on the appearance of things. It's a culture that is about filling selfish desires-consuming things. People come to church with a consumerist's heart instead of a servant's heart.

I will close with Hebrews 5, because I believe it is an apt description of the greater American church:

" 11We have much to say about this, but it is hard to explain because you are slow to learn. 12In fact, though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you the elementary truths of God's word all over again. You need milk, not solid food! 13Anyone who lives on milk, being still an infant, is not acquainted with the teaching about righteousness. 14But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil"

Look, Youngblood, if they don't even mention God in their song at all, how are we supposed to know their not just more wannabe gangsters?

you know rocks, trees and even the stars do not "mention" God, but they all declare his glory.

"churchianity" is killing our love for one another, and our witness in this world.

If you like the song, and it is not sinful, and yet does not mention Jesus, and yet is performed by christians, where does it belong?

I ask again, what makes something Christian? is it the words spoken more than the heart behind them?

I am going to rest my case upon one scriputre:


"These people come near to me with their mouth and honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship of me is made up only of rules taught by men."

Isaiah 29:13

i like the beat to this song but its not even talking about god this chould not be on a christian website

can someone tell me what this song is about...im usually good at this...

I mean i like the song, it just dosen't belong on a christian rap sight. Nice flow, just nothing spiritual at all. Overall: 2/5

Production: Nice Love the Beat Production on This Track 5/5

Quality: Real Nice 5/5

Content: Trash, No offense I didn't feel it at all...I stink I got good swag, I got girls....etc. not what i'm looking for 0/5

Rhyme Delivery: Real tight, he hit the groove of the track just right 5/5

All i heard in this song was how big his swag was, how many girls he got, and he stinks. What is this doing on a CHRISTIAN rap site? I need to hear a song that actually talks about God from these guys.

Definatly not glorifing God on 4 of the 5 tracks on their EP, but their sound is tight. After reading this thread I didn't know what to expect."Spoken" boldly mentions "laying down his life & letting God lead the way". that is as good as it gets as far as edification. The debate about "Christian Emcees vs. Emcees that are Christian" will never end or be won. There will only be losers, the biggest ones being the unsaved.

HipHope Hits has consistantly put out songs that are far from "preachy", a perfect example is B. Reith's "Go On" from 2007 it has nothing to do with God at all.In 2009 however B. Reith's "Bottom of the 9th" hits it out of the park,figuratively and literally using a sports metaphor for God. Don't shut these guys down so fast they might suprise you in 2011!

God Bless!

heyyy as long as their music isnt contradicting the word, i really dont care but to put it into the christian music genre thats another story.

and i dont know them at all so theres no way i can see if their walk is in correlation with the word!!

...so on a lighter note, im feelin it. got a good beat

I feel you on that note fam. I'd be willing to hear more from these dudes in the future. I don't really think one song is enough to really establish New Rebel Flag's musical identity. I'm not hating on these guys either. They will appeal to some more than others. They know that already. Its some good music on Rapzilla, so they know they gotta compete for an audience. It is what it is. Maybe in the future, these dudes can try to make it slightly more obvious(for those of us who don't know them) that they are on a mission to elevate Christ for all to see, whether with a little subtlety or a lot. And that would shut out 50% of the negative posts that say that same thing. The informed Christian listener would recognize the Bible or the inspiration and everybody else would listen for the beat and the production quality and all that jazz. Christian artists don't have it easy though, so I see what you meant that they shouldn't rag on them. Thats whats ups Pastor J, I feel you.

Nite_Al

I think I may not have made myself clear and to that I'm sorry. The fact is that you may have just not liked the song and that's fine. But to rip on someone because they don't Scream Jesus every 10 seconds isn't right either. I agree with you when you said we all have different tastes... and the fact is I like 116 and some KJ... I'm tired of other Christians tearing down one another. We need to become the body... and support it even if we don't like it... if it helps to benefit the Kingdom then we should be behind it. The fact is that most people that posted something negative was because of the fact "it just doesn't praise the Lord"... Well praise is just lifting Gods name up. David "PRAISED" God even when he asked God to smite his enemies and smash their teeth out... did he not? David was a man after Gods own heart wasn't he? Yet he spoke and sang about real life struggles and battles. See my problem isn't with someone that doesn't like the beat... my problem is when people that disqualify someone based on the fact that they don't say a Bible Verse or Jesus every 10 seconds in a song like most of KJ's and 116's songs do. (I'm not hating on KJ or 116... I'm simply using them as an example.)

Oh and to the last comment about raining on their "ministry"... We are all ministers of the Gospel... So yes... it is a ministry... just like 116 and KJ have their own ministry...

Man song is dope love the beat has a nice groove and the strings on the song sticks out real good vocals clean and like the radio voice at the end big ups New Rebel Flag cant wait too see whats next for yall keep moving peace

Okay, so a lot of people are making the whole page some sort of christian philosophical debate and accusing the other posters of being hypocritical and a host of other things. You can't even come to that conclusion by reading that someone didn't like "Nitty Gritty". If somebody doesn't like the song, they just don't like it. I'm not a hypocrite because I don't like this song, and I'm still saved if I don't like it. Let the Bible be the standard, better yet, let God be true and every man be a liar. Just because a person is Christian doesn't mean he has to like Nitty Gritty or he is judging. New Rebel Flag probably would want to know about all views and may appreciate the honesty. And honestly, the message in this particular song is lacking. Its not a matter of "understanding it" or anything, it just isn't there. It hasn't been sneaked in by some clever means of wording. And by the logic of a previous post, the fact that nobody is perfect would mean that nobody would have Christ centered lyrics - if we're trying to argue that the song is a reflection of the imperfection of man. We all know we're imperfect, but gospel music still exists. That being said, that is fine. You can't honestly read someones' nagative post and call them a hypocrite. That is not a reflection of their fruit, they just don't like the song. There is nothing particularly wrong with the song and to call it "secular" is not to call it evil or say the band members aren't saved. They may be just fine, we are just here to talk about the music. And the song does not sound like Christian music, and it begs the question "What is the message?" But that is for the listener to decide. Everything was created to glorify God, I'm just saying I like music that edifies. That is a personal preference. I expect that of my Christian rap. I love Pro and Trip Lee and I like KJ52 and all those sincere dudes even if the name of our Lord is not in the song. I'm just not feeling this one, and there is nothing wrong with that. Somebody else may love it, and thats cool too. Nobody is trying to rain on their "ministry" or whatever they call their main mission.

For those of you that might not understand what a Hypocrite is let me just educate you.
The Websters Dictionary defines the word hypocrite as - "a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue or religion."
You see the fact is that all of you so called Christians that want to tear down another man really aren't Christians. You are nothing more than false prophets and the type of people that Jesus preached against. You are nothing more than "vipers" and "white washed tombs!"
You tear down another mans ministry because you can't see the good in it. The fact of the matter is it doesn't really matter if you see any good in it or not. God is the judge and jury of man not some self righteous Christian that thinks they've got it together.

1 Chronicles 16:22 - “on’t you dare touch my anointed ones,
don’t lay a hand on my prophets.”

The church has forgotten that we are brothers and sisters in Christ. We have forgotten to support one another and lift one another up. Christians are a joke. The people of this world don't need another Bible verse... They need the love of Christ. The sad part is Christians can't even learn to love one another (let alone someone of this world)... we tear each other down with negative words and disqualify one another from the destiny God has for each other. You aren't the church... you aren't the BRIDE OF CHRIST... you are nothing more than a WHORE. You prostitute the Gospel of Christ and build your own kingdoms rather than his. Grow Up And Go Read You Word! Stop being so heavenly minded that you aren't any earthly good. Build his Kingdom not your own. Learn to love and support one another.

I think Gandhi said it best... "I like your Christ but, I do not like your Christians..."

It's time that we change this... be the love of God rather than his wrath and judgment. No man is fit to judge another man... so lets start loving people as Christ did.

New Rebel Flag is on the cutting edge of ministry. They are taking the Gospel back to the streets and out of the church... just because they don't scream "JESUS FREAK" doesn't mean they aren't affecting change in peoples lives. They have ministered to me and young people in my youth group with their music.

THANK God he looks a the heart of man im old enough to remember 30 years ago when anew ministry by the name of carman came on the sence and shook the christian world he was brave enough to chslleng tradion by obeying god thousands were born into the kingdomso lets see what god is doing with these young men who are are seeking his perfectwill

If ur comment aint poistive then rather skip ur ungodly comments.
What would Jesus comment?? we are to be like Christ in Spirit, he blesses us with his likeness and every step towrds the light is a victory so if our Christian brethrens are still feeding on milk then let them be u kno the word says wen u are attactd negatively it means u doing great! Big ups to these dudes cause u dnt kno what was in their hearts wen doing this track only Christ is perfect!! so remember this song has a message we are all unclean broken and dirty 2 many Christians wan to be Christian without the learning and being broken and thats impossible we have to be broken to be delivered into Righteous victory! Give thanks for this song because it has obviously convicted alot of sinful nature so always remember What would Jesus say or do?? Amen Glory be to God only! selfish vanity are for carved images which we as desciples are not!!! Big ups to New Rebel Flag!!!

another pointless debate that really doesn't get anyone anywhere. Just judge the music by the following:

Production:
Quality:
Content:
Rhyme Delivery:

get off your high horse, if you don't like it then fine, stop throwing darts at artist are Christians yet do music because they can and love the art.

You turks are too funny and yet rather annoying.

Every negative post on here only hurts this bands ministry. Why?
Because no one knows what god had called another man/artist todo with there music.
Stop hatin on people that ate trying new ways to get people to look at god.
God will be the judge. Don't like it? Dont listen but Dont spend your time
posting things against bands that don't suit you. Jesus hung out with tax collecters
and Hookers sinners and the sick. And people questioned him.remember this read it very carefully...
Speaking against bands like "New Rebel Flag" is speaking against god and his purpose for these great men who have the guts to go into dark places to pull out gods children!!!!!!
Conversation over. OVER move on.....

I think we should all take some advice from JR on his interview on DJ Wade O radio show episode 131 http://www.wadeoradio.com when he mentions how he used to shun artists such as KJ52 for not saying Jesus emough. He said that he had to repent for judging them because he realized that some of these people really love Jesus so unless it is working against the kingdom, he will not judge them.

Let's keep in mind that there are people who think no matter how much Christ lifting is in Christian Rap that just because it's rap it cannot be used by God. My brother got saved after I gave him a bunch of Christian rap. If we can't even stick together as a Christian Rap community how can we unite with the rest of the body?

The beef on these message boards could be turning away the people who have been blessed by Christian Rap for the first time so let us love one another and encourage all kinds of music that can be used for the kingdom, because at the end of the day, God can use whatever music he wants to bring one to Christ.

"I dont think that anyone can contest that christian rap reaches hardly anyone but people who are already sold out to Christ."

Not even commenting on the song, but on a comment that's ignorant(without knowledge, not the same as stupid) as this one.

I can name one whom it reaches people other than those sold out to Christ. Richie Righteous's music has reached and driven people to change their lives for example:

1. homosexuals have been convicted with the song "Who You Represent?"
2. A gang member gave his life to Christ in a hospital after hearing his first album "Censorship"


Just because you don't think that Christian rap reaches people other than Christians doesn't make it so. I hate it when people make assertions like that without evidence.

I know there are plenty other artists in Christian Hip Hop that has reached all types of people with their music. You need to be confident in what you do for the Lord and the Lord will work through you.

Sorry about my comment earlier. I did misunderstand the song. But by calling a song secular does not mean that it is a bad song. By calling it secular that did not mean that people will go to hell for listening to it. It simply means that it isn't as religious as some of the other songs I have listened to. Even though I don't listen to very much secular music I don't think it's a sin to write, sing, produce, endorse, or listen to secular music unless the song itself is sinful or promotes sin. Once again sorry for the previous post, please pray for me.

I see alot of arguing here about the Christian music industry. I guess I want to just throw in my 2 cents. I am a singer/songwriter and in my experience if you are truly writing out of heart and not just to throw a song out you have to write what you know, sometimes you may feel a certain way and you may write a song that expresses that. Does that make it Christian or secular? In my opinion all it makes the song is honest. If I try to change a song away from my own expression at that moment I am not being honest with myself or those who will eventually listen to the song. Sometimes I may be inspired by something I read in the Bible and sometimes I may be inspired by the events of my day, or something going wrong in my life. None of which make my song Christian or secular it's just a song.

I tend to agree with Jeff on this. "Christian music" unless it happens to be straight up worship music is basically a joke. The Christian music industry is every bit as corrupt as the "secular" music industry, if not more.

Who are we to say what inspired J-Remy to write this unless he has told us? What I hear From it is honesty. I hear a theme of "My righteousness is as filthy rags" honesty about temptation. He isn't Doing the thing most "Christian artists" do and hiding behind this mask of self-righteousness and trendy Christianity.

In my opinion this is more real than any of the "Christian music" that is out there. It deals with real issues that we as humans have on this earth. It doesn't hide or pretend that the struggles we face don't exist. Really this is the same thing facing most churches in this day and age. The fact that churches have a tendency to hide our faults and ignore our struggles until they Come out on their own and that usually ends in a big scandal or just a bunch of fodder for all of the gossipers that we pretend are just concerned members of the church.

I don't see anyone bagging on Toby or Reliant K about their songs that do not "edify Jesus". I have known JRemy for a few years...this dude IS sold out 110%. In fact...in the offtime...ALL members of NRF serve the local church and are active AND accountable. See...people don't know these things. What you also may not know is that JRemy prays before he even picks up a pen. When did we get to the place in the arts where we had to have a cross on everything and a scripture reference behind all that we do. Why not just be great at what you do. If a carpenter...be a GREAT carpenter and speak the name of Jesus while being a great carpenter.

Get your lyrics right homie and take the bible outta ya butt.

"My swag's 'as big as the buckle on my belt'"

The definition of "sweatin"
as defined in the hood as well as in this online urban dictionary http://www.urbandictionary.com...rm=Sweatin

I believe maybe the song confused you, a little.... but its ok, I'll be praying for you

I know pretty much everyone on here will disagree with me on this, but whats the purpose of all these christian rappers giving testimonies and preaching God's word if it only gets listened to by christians? I dont think that anyone can contest that christian rap reaches hardly anyone but people who are already sold out to Christ. I understand this song doesnt have any direct Biblical references or what not but what kind of secular individual is going to go out of his/her way to buy and/or listen to some music all about a god he/she doesnt serve or care about. This is a huge problem with christian music in my opinion. Christian artists only make music that suits the interests of christians. In my opinion this does nothingg to reach the lost and hurting world. If you want to preach salvation and God's love then you're gonna have to go a bit secular. No one is gonna get saved because you write a song about the ten commandments! come on, we live in an extremely fallen world and if you want to reach people through hiphop then you better be willing to step foot over the line that seperates christian and secular rap and start rapping about something that the secular audience might have a slight interest in. I give mad props to New Rebel Flag for keeping it real and realizing that the secular audience isnt going to come to jesus through rapping about some scriptures or some man that lived two thousand years ago, but they are gonna come to him when they meet on a common interest level and allow these guys to then later plant seeds once they have the audience hooked.... thats just my take on things though.. i could be wrong but i believe christian artists have to step up their game big time nowadays and to stop singing to the choirs, as they say.

Calling this song Christian would be a stretch? Really?
I like this song. It’s more a humbling song than anything else; it seems as if the point of this song is to claim that they themselves are imperfect. They don’t look or act like what a “typical” Christian or typical Christian artist would, but they still make music that they like that may or may not glorify God in obvious ways.
I wouldn’t judge them by this song on their conduciveness to building the Kingdom of God. J Remy has other songs, such as “Cut Me” that have very powerful Godly messages. Just because you may not understand a song, or even disagree with the song doesn’t mean that God won’t be able to use it to reach out and touch others. You could use the verse 1 Corinthians 1:27 to support this: But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong.
I know that these comments are a gut-reaction to hearing something new and different, but don’t be so quick to shut the door on them. If you want to make an educated decision, listen to their other stuff on their website, pray about it, and listen to what your spirit says about it. If you don’t like them then don’t listen to them, just don’t write them off as secular artists masquerading as Christians.

I can understand the point of Jeff Youngblood but I still don't see how this song could help glorify God. Even though that is true I don't see how this song works against the kingdom... to an extent.

As I listen to the lyrics I don't hear any swearing but he does say stuff such as

Exodus 20:13
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house; {S} thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his man-servant, nor his maid-servant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's. {P}

The above verse was contradicted with multiple lines in which this artist boasted on infidelity such as "maybe that's why your girl keep sweatin me" in verse two.



Also, at the end of the second verse he says " If you come around here, acting tough,they will find your rump in them honey island swamps, you dig"? That can also be contradicted by the ten commandments with Exodus
20:12 Thou shalt not murder.

"my swag's this big it's the devil on my belt" in the first verse. This can be contradictory to the following verse.

Proverbs 8:13 The fear of the Lord is to hate evil; I hate arrogant pride and the evil way and perverse utterances

He also said " I'm a pot of gold with my potty mouth ways." At the beginning of the second verse and "I'm trippin stickin' like humidity", which can be left to interpretation but could also be contradicted by the above verse.

I still believe that rather than shunning these people we should pray for them and help them come closer to Christ.

One thing I notice about all the detractors of this song/group is an absence of any of God's word, or expounding from the scriptures about how this is "un-christian" What I do see, however, is a lot of comparison to a "Gospel" or "Christian music" industry standard.

"substitute music?" What is that even? What a joke.

What is it that even decides one artist is "christian" and another is not? Seems like it is decided by democracy, or a corporate committiee somewhere behind closed doors. I think of all the good music a lot of sinners wont even come into contact with because it is in the "Christian" music section, and our concert venues and radio stations are delineated in the same manner.

Does labeling something MAKE it more Christian? When I brush my teeth, is that a secular or "spiritual" act? what about when I paint my front porch?

All this labeling, does exactly what Jesus DID NOT WANT-create a Christian sub-culture. A bubble of protection from the world. And what it does is keep sinners out who NEED the love of Christ. Here it is:

""15My prayer is not that you take them out of the world but that you protect them from the evil one. 16They are not of the world, even as I am not of it. "

john 17:15-16

So, what makes a message "christian?" Is it the amount of times you mention the Cross? Perhaps we should come up with a system. If a song mentions it 10 times, it is of the Lord, but 9 and a half-"nope, sorry." I mean, let's spell out the rules so that every band knows exactly when they are on one side of the line.

I use a ridiculous analogy to make a point. There really are ONLY two categories of behavior for us-what is sinful and what isn't. If this song is sinful, I want any one person to point out exactly how. Please use scripture.

As I see it, it is a simple fullfilling of something Paul did, "I have become all things to all men so that by all possible means I might save some. I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings." ! Corinthians 9:23

Is the theology in the words perfect? no. Do we forget that these guys are made of flesh and bone? But I really get the heart of what they are expressing. It might be one of the most artful hip-hop portrayals of man's fallen nature I have ever heard. It has subtlety that is so absent, generally, from "christian" music, which is by and large is just mediocre because it "forces" itself to be Christian, rather than reflecting the culture it came out of. I have news for people. God created culture. And if it is not engaging in a sinful act, he wants to redeem it.

My advice to this band is to seek the Lord, and pray for conviction of areas of sin. Beyond that, make your music unto the Lord, and not for the approval of other artist, or the Christian music sector, which by and large is just as messed up as the Secular music sector in the way they do things.

Colossians 3:23 "Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for men,

J Remy the bald guy in the pic is the guy who originally made this song and hes a christian artist but some of his stuff isnt. kinda like Pigeon John

First off why does this song even up to 3 stars? Second, why would Rapzilla even put the song up? This is no where near Christian.

I think the beat and flow are cool, but the message? Maybe it's just me (and almost everyone who commented below me), but I can't find it. Maybe it's…… naw… I don't know. If this crew comes out with something new, I'll judge them by that.

go to www.newrebelflag.com

i don't like it

Umm...I really don't get this one either. This has absolutely nothing to do with any psalm. To call it Christian, would take more than a stretch. And since the artist is new to most of us, it is hard for them to establish a Christ-centered mission or Christian hip hop fan base with this one. It almost seems like a mistake. I'm just not feeling it. I need to hear more music from these cats because right now, The message is lacking.

I really don't get how this is a gospel track..it really sounds secular.

I honestly feel like this is real life, real music. Maybe this is one aspect of another believers life written in a time of struggle not a time of praise. Just another spin. Maybe you should go read the book of psalms and look at the different expressions of davids heart love, war, piece, hate, vengeance, guidance, praise and worship...

im not tryin to be funny, but i dont understand the song....whats it talking about

umm... I listened to the song about 3 times, and didn't hear anything praising The Lord... am I missing something here?

Not feelin this, doesn't spread the word of God at all.

not diggin this track =/ i understand urban gospel is tryin to take things to the next level, i kno this because im a part of this movement, but at the end of the day, your music as a christain artist should still hold a message. to me, i feel like this song lacked that and it honestly sounds like a song made by what the church would call a "secular" artist. im all for growth and stepping out of the box, but remember our purpose as gospel artist is to create wut i call the "substitute music". God Bless